Aside from the fact that the way EVE is put together, the whole Gǣdo your own thingGǥ doesn't really existGǪ nothing. The problem with missions is that their effort:reward is out of whack.

It's a single economy. Any given activity spewing out ISK at an unreasonable rate is problematic.

So blitzing gives lots of isk. Do most people do this? Does a new char running L4 solo in a T1 with partial T2 fit T1 BS get 60m/hr, or are we talking someone in a T2 / faction fitted BS/T2 BS/Faction BS?

What is the training time for the latter vs the former. What is the income in a T1 battleship?

what you can do in high sec in PERFECT safety.

Not true. There is one mission you can do without undocking; War Situation (the courier version.) If you have reports in your hangar, accept mission, click complete. A one second mission that provides 18,000 LP/min.

Well its not bloody dangerous if you aren't a tard and/or don't run around with a 13 billion isk officer fit.

The same way you blitz a mission. Kill only what you need to kill to get your loot, and go.

The thing that is most disturbing, is that we have CSM's with a clear bias and agenda, and who's opinions 100% benefit themselves and their low-sec/null-sec buddies... but not what is in the best, long-term, interests of the game.

All of the "risk v reward" arguments are one-sided, self-serving, and deeply flawed.
Unfortunately, it is obvious what the "thoughts and opinions" of the player community this CSM is communicating to CCP.

The true agenda of this CSM, and the players he is supporting, isn't really about making easy ISK in level IV missions; it is another very poorly disguised attack supporting the agenda to force PvE players, in PvE fit ships, into Low-Sec so they can be easy targets for the "pirates".

If you are successful in getting your agenda implemented, and you begin funneling all the PvE players into Low-Sec so they can be target practice for those who are getting bored gate-camping for noobs, it might be great for you and your buddies (for a while), but it will be ultimately bad for the game and will result in losing a lot of players.

Does that mean they also are aware of what, um, short documentaries on human biology, watch while mining

That's horse ****, high sec is not perfect safety, you've obviously never been wardecced. Take a look at the map most days more people die in highsec than in low or null. I've lived in null and if you are in the right corp and blue to lots of people, you can farm isk all day long. It's safer than highsec.

Yea, those high sec people who rarely ever die while having access to infinite missions while not even having to glance at local and who can go afk at ANY TIME and just leave their ship in space/at a gate sure do have it rough man. I don't see how they make it day to day......

You're being taken on a spin. My advice is just to let him have the last word.

GǪand your argument for why you draw a different conclusion based on that and the other evidence provided isGǪ what, exactly?

Sure there is, but not necessarily for that particular reason.

The reason I'd like to see them nerfed is because this would open up for a better activity ecology and, consequently, a far more granular approach to income balancing. I don't think L4s should offer the kind of high-end income it currently allows for, but rather be a natural stepping-stone towards something else. The numbers you're seeing should be the upper end of what they offer rather than some kind of half-mediocre medium. Even without your escape-hatch to Stain, you should be chomping at the bit and thinking that yeah, no, time to move onGǪ

GǪand actually have the option of doing so. Of course, for many, this might not turn out to be any appreciable nerf at all GÇö they simply aren't running L4s at the efficiency where they hit that ceiling, and that's perfectly fine.

All of this is something (almost) completely separate to the discussion of ISK and material flow, where the core argument isn't really about nerfing anything, but about skewing the income more towards items and trade-ins (e.g. loyalty points). Here, L4s present a problem by only trending towards that type of income once you get to the high end (the aforementioned 60M/h-and-up tier).

And finally, there's a third tangent (that hasn't shown up that much in this thread), which is the overall discussion of how much you're Gǣsupposed toGǥ be able to earn in different parts of spaceGǪ

~~~~Highsec is Safe~~~~

I'm not sure the word "safe" means what you think it does. Why did you add so many spaces to your post?

"Safe" is a very relative term. You seem to prefer simple ideas, so that's what I shall use in my examples. Let's pretend hi-sec is a house. You can lock the doors, bar the windows, install a burglar alarm, hire some private security, maybe even purchase your own gun. You've created a relatively safe house. The only way to enter or destroy it at that point is to do something extreme, such as bulldoze it or commit arson. Such extreme acts will, naturally, incur the wrath of local law officials.

In null-sec, the house is gone. There are very few locks or bars available for your own protection. As there is no official police force, violent acts must be avenged by your community or you will all become vulnerable to further aggression. It's also some of the most fun you can have in an MMO where a large percentage of the player base considers staring at rocks engaging and worth their spare time.

If you're interested in seeing the real EvE online, I would be more than willing to sponsor you in to GoonWaffe once I have received your security deposit.

I apologize that my point remains elusive to you; however, I feel I have made my point well. Perhaps if you were less intent on arguing and trolling, constantly repeating your question, we would be able to have a civil discussion. I have no interest in engaging you in a slap fight.

Highsec is so risky, we need to reward them more

Thank you for your concern with my posting, though I assure you I am well aware of the rules of the communicatory process.

Unfortunately, I feel it is necessary to point out the unabbreviated form of "hisec", which is "high security". While you may be shot at, there are rather dire consequences compared to low and null security regions. This, again, indicates the relativity of the word "safe". I believe that identifying the intricacies of this game in as simple a summation as A or B may lead to misinformation as well as misunderstanding between players.

Perhaps you would understand if you spent some time as a part of the Swarm? I am willing to waive a portion of your security deposit, should you wish to explore the part of EvE online that gaming journalists are actually interested in telling you about.

I shouldn't have to follow any evidence trail. It should be presented in order for us to understand a coherent argument. If I argued against or for global warming you would expect me to provide solid peer reviewable facts that either support my argument that warming is somehow happening or that it isn't. It's no good me saying to you to visit your local library or even worse get on the internet, or that google is your friend, because naturally enough I might not find the same sources that you are relying upon to support your argument. This is intellectual laziness or a big fat dishonesty shield....